10 Dec 2017 04:35:04
It would seem that Lomachenko is going to end up being the best ever.
{Ed001's Note - can he really be called that when boxing as a whole is much weaker than it used to be? The quality level seems much lowered in recent years, particularly with the rise of UFC, which sees a lot of the troubled kids that used to end up in boxing do MMA instead. To be completely dominant you do not need to be at the Ali/Johnson/Louis level any more do you?}
1.) 10 Dec 2017
10 Dec 2017 07:00:38
Not if what you're doing is revolutionary to the sport, or if you're a freak.
Roy Jones Jnr fought a lot of walking punch bags and he's considered an immortal in boxing. Because he was a freak in his prime, completely untouchable.
The same may later on down the line apply to Lomachenko and I think it will if he leaves that dinosaur promoter Bob Arum.
2.) 22 Dec 2017
22 Dec 2017 09:28:10
I work in boxing as both a writer and now with a promoter and have worked closely with Loma in the past, but c'mon he's doing great things but there are 4 belts in every division and twice as many divisions.
No one will ever come close to the levels of Ray Robinson, Henry Armstrong again. It's too difficult to get those fights made. Lomachenko could never replicate what Armstrong did, winning a legitimate World Title at Featherweight, Lightweight and Welterweight.
His World Title at Featherweight was a vacant one, he's have to beat Mikey Garcia at Lightweight (who I think he'd struggle with) to call himself THE LW champion and then beat Thurman (or Crawford if Crawford is able to be as dominant at Welter as he was at LW) .
He's a great fighter but best ever is ridiculously premature.
3.) 28 Dec 2017
28 Dec 2017 19:20:17
VLom as the best ever? Nope. I don't think any fighter in this era will ever get close to the best ever.
4 Championship belts, the ability and willingness to duck the toughest fights.
SRL beat a prime Benitez, Hearns, Duran and Hagler. Think any fighter in this era would be willing to face prime fighters consistently. Don't think so and that's why none of them can be close to "The Best Ever"
4.) 31 Dec 2017
31 Dec 2017 18:05:34
I see what you guys are saying, but I would just like to say. I didn't say he is the best ever, I said it looks like he's going to be the best ever.
Imred, I'm with you on Garcia, personally I think he's fundamentally flawless. He's probably my favourite boxer right now.
You've all said that given the level of competition etc, it won't be possible for Lomachenko to become "TBE". I genuinely disagree for a number of reasons.
1). Many boxers have had low level opposition, yet still been considered a great. A good couple of examples are Roy Jones. Jr, Mike Tyson and both of the Klitschko's. They had high level fights yes, but for 80% of their career, they fought punch bags with legs.
2). Lomachenko does things so differently. His training regimes are impressive, but it's what he does in the ring that makes him special. 4 people in a row have retired after the 6th round against him, including Lomachenko's "nightmare" Rigondeaux.
3). The sport is changing because of him, more and more people are adopting the mental training methods that Lomachenko uses. They're even naming movement patterns after him, like the side stepping that he does, I've heard quite a few trainers call it "the Lomachenko step/ slip".
Not many boxers get techniques named after them.
4). Lomachenko isn't ducking anyone. Everyone is ducking him. An example is Orlando Salido - Lomachenko has been chasing the rematch ever since they first fought, Salido wanted nothing of it and has now retired, after getting startched by Miguel Roman.
As for his level of opposition, again I would argue.
I don't see how you can say that fighters from previous era's over shadow modern fighters. The fact is, due to diets and training regimes people are a lot faster, stronger and have better technique than years ago.
Naturally this is all subjective and it's just my opinion.
5.) 02 Jan 2018
02 Jan 2018 09:54:11
Based on his resume now, I don't see many persons that will vote him into the HoF if he were to retire tomorrow.
While I agree with you that he's extra special, the fact is that he doesn't have the longevity yet.
Roy Jones didn't have the best of opponents, but he didn't lose any fight - and barely lost rounds - from middleweight to heavyweight. Infact, he barely lost minutes of rounds. He was that much above everyone and he did it for a long time.
Wladimir also ruled the heavyweight division for 10 years.
Look at most of the ATG, they were dominant for a long period.
We can all see that Loma is special. His mental processing is Mayweather-level. But he doesn't have the longevity yet.
Right now, most persons are happy to have him as No.1 P4P despite having less than 15 fights. But he hasn't been a pro for that long that anyone will have him as a contemporary great, much less as an ATG.
Maybe the best amateur ever. But as a professional, not yet.
6.) 05 Jan 2018
05 Jan 2018 00:51:36
Roy Jones Jr has Antonio Tarver, James Toney, Bernard Hopkins, Virgil Hill and Mike McCallum all on his resume.
Sure he fought some average guys but there isn't anyone Loma could beat (Garcia aside) up to 140 that would even come close to any of those wins.
I also completely disagree with guys from the modern era being better than older fighters. Nicolino Locche, Aaron Pryor or SRR would wipe the floor with anyone fighting at 140 now, styles have always made fights not eras.
Loma is a special fighter, but he's not doing anything new. The 'Loma side step' isn't new to boxing Pacquiao has done it, Willie Pep was doing it in the 1940's. Loma is bringing back techniques that modern fighters don't use very often, 'styles' in boxing come in repeat waves depending on what is successful in that era and who the prominent trainers/ fighters are.
Loma reminds me of Calzaghe-Lacy often. Loma will not be the best ever, I'd put money on it. He's world class a once in a generation fighter but there isn't anyone matching Armstrong or Robinsons achievements. He has to beat Garcia to be anywhere close on a top 10 list.